Winds of Winter twist to involve dead Game of Thrones Character 

IGN, George R.R. Martin dishes on a previous plot that he has indeed decided to go through with. He also talks writing delays, working on

I have decided to do that, yes. It’s something that involves a couple characters one whom is dead in the show but not dead in the books. So the show can’t do this, unfortunately.”

Sadly, even Martin says that doesn’t narrow it down much considering there are some odd 15 characters dead on the show yet alive in the books.

news, Michele Clapton won the award for Excellence in Fantasy Television Series for her costume work with the show! Well done and congratulations!

Check out all the winners and nominees for the Costume Designers Guild here.

Who do you think the plot revolves around? What do you think could happen? Let us know below!

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Edit: Cracked by a ginger snap. At least gingers win at something.

It’s definitely going to be… ummm… hmmm… well… oh! I know! Wait…

George has mentioned before about a twist he thought up about a character, but for some reason memory tells me it was about Sansa, not a dead-on-show, not-in-books person. Anybody else remember this? Something about a storyline having to come about organically for the character, not a twist for the sake of being different from the path the show has taken.

I’m going with Mance as the one dead on tv but alive in the books

Oberyn Martell..i thought it was strange that he was on one of the released season 6 posters

My first thought was Jojen, but even in the books it is somewhat implied he might be a goner amirite

oh yeah…I forgot about Mance..that’s another possible victim

I’m gonna go with Barry the Bold here

She doesn’t exist in the show (and a replacement character is not the same) so… no. Plus, he mentioned that prologue before he mentioned the twist. Definitely not her.

Isn’t Mance already a twist in the books, though?

STANNIS THE MANNIS who doesn’t burn his daughter for no good reason

It could also be Shireen…I think book readers maybe already assume that though(?)

He’s dead in the books and on the show. Can’t be him.

Stannis is my gut reaction, but it could be anybody. Did he not complain a great deal when they killed off an early but tertiary character? Was it Ros?

Does anybody else get the sense that this is a reaction to the show overtaking the books? It feels like GRRM is purposely trying to change parts of the story in order for him to say the books going to be worth reading once the show spoils it.

That is a great bet. I also think it could be

Jeyne, as if I recall, she is intended to be in the prologue, and I read a theory somewhere about her proclaiming Roslyn Frey’s (I can’t remember her name, Edmure’s wife) son as Jeyne’s own son, heir to the King in the North, after an attack on them (Edmure, Roslyn, Jeyne) orchestrated by Bfish while being moved as hostages to Casterly Rock. THAT would be a twist. I don’t know if I explained it well.

Mance takes some wildling women and infiltrates Winterfell, then later when Jon receives the ‘pink letter’, the author of the letter says that Mance and his women were captured (don’t remember if the letter said they were dead

Didn’t he mention at one point that he was thinking about killing off a major female characters that he hadn’t originally?

Im going with Barry falling to his death from Rhaegal or Viserion during the battle for Meereen. He rides one to battle the arriving Ironborn.

The show is canon now. GRRM has to stop creating fanfiction and stick to the main plot of the source material (the show). 😉

Stannis is Azor Ahai after all! Seriously, I wonder if it’s a minor or major character? Anyone care to write a comprehensive list of all dead characters in the series that are alive on the books?

I do. I think he is just overestimating the importance of that plot twist. As always.

Yeah I hope it’s Stannis, but Mance or Barristan could just as likely be it. Probably one of those three.

George has mentioned before about a twist he thought up about a character,but for some reason memory tells me it was about Sansa, not a dead-on-show, not-in-books person.Anybody else remember this?Something about a storyline having to come about organically for the character, not a twist for the sake of being different from the path the show has taken.

The only thing Sansa-related that I remember him saying was regarding her controversial chapter, that was moved from aFFC to WoW

Dead in the show alive in the books pretty much limits it to Stannis, Mance, Barristan, Jeyne, or Jojen, and Jojen is probably a stretch.

Dead in the show, dead in the books. They show Joffrey’s face, too, and he’s not coming back.

Who cares? Already struggling to avoid falling into irrelevance, I see. It’s inevitable. You brought this on yourself. Now accept the consequences instead of trying to pimp lame twists.

Could be Myrcella. She was part of a plot in the books, and I imagine they aren’t done with her just yet.

Well … it’s not a spoiler, it’s a guess.

Sadly the cynical view of his motivations (unconscious, anyway) doesn’t seem out of bounds.

Looks like no one has mentioned Pyp & Grenn, so there’s some more possibilities.

Agreed. Same as WotW apparently, as GRRM Has already States some four years ago that this character is khal jhaqo.

Essos: Barristan Selmy, Hizdahr zo Loraq, Xaro Xan Daos The North: Jon Snow

I don’t think Jeyne Westerling can be the one since she’s not on the show at all.

I would bet that the “twist” is about the authorship of the pink letter, with the two characters he’s got in mind being Ramsay and Mance.

To many characters have been killed before their time in show so they could rush to finish the story in seven seasons with only ten episodes per season. Some of them are Mance, Pyr, Grenn, Stanis, Jeyne, Myrcella, Jojen, Barristan and several in Meeren.

The more he diverges from the show, the better, imho. This silliness indicates that GRRM is not under any contractual obligation to keep his ASoI&F vision consistent with the “drafted with D&D” HBO version. Expect many more divergences in the future. As indicated by the changes from the initial 1993 outline, and now echoed with this odd disclosure, the tale is told in the telling.

Maybe it’s Jojen? Mance? Maybe Selmy! Stannis? Perhaps Shireen? Fun to speculate the possible differences!

Looks like no one has mentioned Pyp & Grenn, so there’s some more possibilities.

So, he’s going out of his way to do something the show can’t do and letting the show influence his story. That pretty lame George.

The thing that is discouraging from GRRMs response is that he makes it seem that he hasn’t even started writing this twist yet. He did say it was going to be in WoW (not DoS), right? Sigh

So, he’s going out of his way to do something the show can’t do and letting the show influence his story.That pretty lame George.

Im a little appalled STILL at all the anger targeted at GRRM… really? Is that really necessary? The damage is done. The books are not going to be finished before the end of the series. Being a book reader AND a watcher on the Boobtube I find it interesting that fans are still trying to roast the author. Geesh folks….. let it go!!

The more he diverges from the show, the better, imho. This silliness indicates that GRRM is not under any contractual obligation to keep his ASoI&F vision consistent with the “drafted with D&D” HBO version. Expect many more divergences in the future. As indicated by the changes from the initial 1993 outline, and now echoed with this odd disclosure, the tale is told in the telling.

Maybe it’s Jojen? Mance? Maybe Selmy! Stannis? Perhaps Shireen? Fun to speculate the possible differences!

Agreed. At this point, I am happy that the last two books will be different so I can enjoy even MORE of the world of Westeros. Bonus!

GRRM is somewhere near finished with respect to TWOW. As of last summer, he was hoping to finish by the end of the year. Obviously that planned failed, but it should be clear that this “twist” is something that occurs near the end of the book, probably in that POV character’s final chapter, when big “twists” are likely to occur. Thus, short-range speculation based on where we are at the end of ADWD is pretty aimless, as there is an entire book between what we have and the point that this even will occur.

As side points: If it were Stannis, that would mean he survives until near the end of TWOW. That, in turn, would make it kinda possible for him to sacrifice Shireen. As it stands, it is entirely unclear how this would happen in the books, given their geographical separation and Stannis’s short life expectancy. As for Selmy, I don’t see much chance of him surviving the upcoming battle he is confronted with, and it is hard to imagine him having some big “twist”, being so straight-laced. Mance is more of a wildcard. Myrcella makes some sense, too.

Well, I started reading the books some months ago, after the end of season 5, and they were absolutely worth reading, even if I already knew most of the story. I’m sure I’m not the only one. He must have sold much more books thanks to the show, so I don’t think GRRM is worried about the sales… Books and show started to differ long time ago. There’s a lot of things and characters missing, or changed, or dead before the time… And I presume they’ll differ even more in the future.

The twist is that, at the very end, all of Westeros is in ruins, deserted, and Ned crawls out from under the rubble, sole survivor.

SMH at the ‘show-wankers’ claiming that the show is canon now and the author’s vision is ‘irrelevant.’ These books will still be read when the HBO version seems as quaint and primitive as silent movies. New ‘screen’ versions will be made at least once a generation, for whatever new visual medium has arisen.

My money’s on Selmy. Hope springs eternal that he will yet get his chance to betray Dany.

Didn’t they stab Jon? I remember Pip being involved.

He’s talking about Ser Barristan Selmy… Jeyne Westerling was not even on the Show.. Talisa Maegyr was another character that took her place, but not the same character.

Demonmonkey: Didn’t they stab Jon? I remember Pip being involved.

GRRM is somewhere near finished with respect to TWOW. As of last summer, he was hoping to finish by the end of the year.

I don’t think that’s evidence of him nearly finishing the book. When he finished AFFC, he thought ADWD would be finished the following year, when in fact, it took 6. GRRM has a bad habit of overestimating his writing speed.

Pyp and Grenn are very much alive at the end of ADwD but they weren’t part of the nationalist mutineer bunch.

The warrior whose throat Drogo ripped off in Lhazareen. What was his name? He was the first character GRRM mentioned, and repeatedly, as an example of show divergence. Now he may have some bad blood with Daenerys.

No. In his attempt to follow the “kill the boy” advice, he sent all four of his best friends in the NW as far away as he could. He sent Edd to .. Long Barrow? (the one with the spearwives) and I believe Pyp and Grenn he sent to Eastwatch. Then he sent Sam on his way, too.

Why oh why would you write that kind of spiteful comment? Why, on a fansite? What is your objektive? George made all this happen! He has no need to try and stay relevant, Winds is gonna sell like crazy, so why would you say that if not because of a deep need in you to be spiteful, condesending and rude. Sorry, but it makes me frustrated. This is the first time I joined a ‘fandom’, and I was shocked to learn that it’s a pretty normal thing to actually trashtalk the creator of either the show or the book or both. It’s a tendency in society, that is based on cynisism which will ultimately lead to cyborgs overtaking the world in a few hundred years. You are adding to that tendency. PS: if YOU’RE just trying to be funny, I can definately accept that. Otherwise, start counting electrical sheep!

Damphairintheshowplease!: It’s a tendency in society, that is based on cynisism which will ultimately lead to cyborgs overtaking the world in a few hundred years.

You know, until that line right there, I thought your comment was honest, if a bit naive. And then you just went right off the deep end there, buddy. Internet cynicism results in cyborgs overtaking the world. That is some classic commenting there. Classic.

Firannion, And uh, never would have read the books without the show. The books really struggle in quality of writing. Without the show, I’m not sure they’d stand the test of time. They certainly aren’t Shakespeare, or Hemingway, Heller, Vonnegut or even Stephen King. They might get remade because the technology will be available to add in some of the things that are just too expensive to produce. But not because the books alone are that important.

I kinda feel like he’s been winging this for awhile now.

1) the chapters released from Winds all seem to clarify divergences of the show from the books (eg Sansa enjoying the world’s largest lemon cake). Stannis in Theon’s chapter diverges existentially from the one on the show.

2) In the immediate aftermath of S5E9, people in the employ of GRRM took to the net to decry the direction of the show re Stannis

3) GRRM in an HBO interview clip clarifies that Stannis is still a righteous man (since the character is so prone to misinterpretation by show watchers). By the time of the interview, the plan to give all of Jon Snow’s questionable plot points to Stannis and all of Stannis’s heroics to Jon was already set in stone at the production level.

GRRM knows that he can be in the pantheon with Tolkien, Herbert etc, but not if he writes dumb-shows for the groundlings like HBO.

Im a little appalled STILL at all the anger targeted at GRRM… really? Is that really necessary? The damage is done. The books are not going to be finished before the end of the series. Being a book reader AND a watcher on the Boobtube I find it interesting that fans are still trying to roast the author. Geesh folks….. let it go!!

I started to read through these comments for the speculation, and frankly the jabs at GRRM are not only unnecessary but some of them are just plain mean.

We wouldn’t be here having this discussion without him, they are HIS characters and if you can’t look at the two worlds as separate of each other, then at least be respectful. He has said multiple times that there is a show Westeros and a book Westeros. I have cursed Dan & Dave my fair share of times, but it doesn’t mean I don’t think they are more or less “relevant” than GRRM.

Oh look, people are reacting to the D&D haters by becoming GRRM haters. That’s very 6th grade of you.

BTW, this is something George brought up prior to season 5. I think it is Lady Stoneheart related, but my second guess would be Mance.

Am I the only one who suspects that the release dates of WoW and aDoS are actually less far apart the we are led to believe? Though GRRM has shown he takes his time as he pleases – which is his right, by all means – I simply can’t believe he and especially the publishers would be too pleased to see the show end sooner than the books, and I just can’t imagine that they would go and release the final book 3 or 4 years after the show has ended and it loses all relevance. Add to the facts that GRRM is not getting any younger – or looking healthier, for that matter – and a possible season 8 and I would say WoW will be released this year around August and aDoS just in time for season 8 to start off.

What questionable Jon plot points were given to Stannis? Likewise, what did Stannis do that was so heroic in ADWD that was transferred to Jon in season 5?

Read my comment again. I said cynisism Will lead to cyborgs overtaking the World. Not internet cynisism. That might still overstating it on my part, bit please explain why the first part of my post was naive of all things. Dont you Think it’s a sad paradox that 70 percent of this fandom is mostly critical toward the thing that the fandom is celebrating, and dont you Think that says something about society? The internet is a forum for everyone, the place where everyone has access. It’s a huge step in humanity. And the general language is filled with degrading comments. I’m sorry, but that scares the crab out of me.

When I finished ADWD, I thought there was no way that Martin would allow the show to catch up to him and that he would right faster than ever. And here we are. Season 6 will be out before Winds, spoiling many plot points. I doubt Martin wanted that to happen either, so I don’t think it’s a matter of what he and his publishers want. He writes when he writes. That’s basically his entire process. So, I don’t think him wanting to finish the books before the series ends is going to have any affect on the outcome.

Yes, you are the only one. If this was the plan, TWOW would be out by now. There’s no way he would hold off on releasing it and allow the show to reveal Jon’s fate and parentage. No, he’s simply older and slower(shocking) now, and the story has grown to be unwieldy.

True, but going by what we (think we) know so far, there is going to be a lot of story from the previous books, this season. Surely, the Jon and Dany plot are going to be spoiled big time but some things need to be seen as opposed to be read to make more of an impact, certainly for the Unsullied non-book readers, which are – like it or not – currently the main target audience.

Like that Harry Potter lady who is still publishing things about the books. So desperate. It’s not hate, guys, but it’s obvious that he misses the attention. And Game of Thrones is cool, but it’s quite poorly written and not exactly a modern classic. It’s gonna lose relevance and be forgotten and he knows it.

“GRRM trying to stay relevant” is probably one of funnier comments I’ve seen. If he released the final book in 2035 it’d be on the best seller list within in a week. He was on the best seller list multiple times over before there was any show. He’s had a niche audience in the sci-fi/fantasy genre since the 70s for crying out loud. “GRRM trying to stay relevant” as your initial response to this (even though it’s something he’s been talking about for over a year) is pathetic and tells me all I need to know.

This site’s comment section is becoming something worth skipping. And it is like that because of a clique of nasty, rude and arrogant commenters who are JUST as bad as the “book purists” they love to despise. The level of dislike these people have for the author is bizarre.

It’s not just Jon and Dany. Bran, Arya, Cersei, Jaime, the Tyrells, Theon, etc. will all have some of their plots spoiled.

Jonathan Coldrain: Am I the only one who suspects that the release dates of WoW and aDoS are actually less far apart the we are led to believe?

No, you’re not the only one. I’ve suspected for a while now that he has been working on the last two books simultaneously, writing out strings of chapters for particular PoVs, then deciding which ones go in TWoW and which ones to hold back for ADoS. Getting this close to the end of the saga, I think that he needs to be extra-careful to get all the setup done in the sixth book that will be required for the payoffs in the seventh. He’s running out of wiggle room and can’t afford to forget any crucial prep work. I think that a gap of a year between the two publication dates is an underestimation, but I don’t think that it will be six years next time either.

That being said, to claim that the last book ‘loses all relevance’ if it comes out later than the final season of the show is just plain absurd. The books do not need the show to validate their worth. They will be sought out just as eagerly by readers regardless of publication date.

Stargaryen: Like that Harry Potter lady who is still publishing things about the books. So desperate.

Are you serious? You don’t know the Potter fandom if you think that Rowling is still doing the odd Potterverse project because she ‘misses the attention.’ She is having plenty of fun cranking out her best-selling Cormoran Strike mysteries, but millions of Potter fans still hang on her every tidbit of extra backstory about the wizarding world, because it is a living, breathing place for them. If anyone is desperate there, it is the fans whose hearts broke when they got to the end of Harry’s saga. They beg for more, and every now and then JKR tosses them a crust.

Wasn’t there a read-headed whore in Wintertown? She didn’t go to KL, so not exactly Ros, but… Actually, now that I come to think of it, she was with Theon in WF, and then Ramsay claimed her and she’s dead.

Dead on show, not in books… The first two I thought of were Pyp and Grenn! I miss them! But I don’t think this “twist” will involve them.

Next I thought of “Robb’s wife” (Talisa on show, Jeyne Westerling in books). Jeyne is going to be in the TWOW prologue. The BwB are definitely up to something in the Riverlands, and what if Jeyne is pregnant…? Perhaps not.

I can’t see a twist for Barri, I think he’s going to die in Meereen. Ditto Hizzy.

Meryn Trant’s still alive in the books but I can’t see a twist for him. Same with Martyn Lannister, though he’s getting closer to being the heir to Casterly Rock…

Mance could provide a few surprises (if the Pink Letter is false).

And Myrcella could become part of some (Dornish?) intrigue.

Also, GRRM said the twist will involve two characters, ONE of whom is dead on the show. Hmm, have to think some more.

That detail makes me think it might have something to do with Jojen and Meera, after all.

“GRRM trying to stay relevant” is probably one of funnier comments I’ve seen. If he released the final book in 2035 it’d be on the best seller list within in a week. He was on the best seller list multiple times over before there was any show. He’s had a niche audience in the sci-fi/fantasy genre since the 70s for crying out loud. “GRRM trying to stay relevant” as your initial response to this (even though it’s something he’s been talking about for over a year) is pathetic and tells me all I need to know.

This site’s comment section is becoming something worth skipping. And it is like that because of a clique of nasty, rude and arrogant commenters who are JUST as bad as the “book purists” they love to despise. The level of dislike these people have for the author is bizarre.

Agreed. It’s starting to sound eerily similar to a certain vitriolic hate site that rants about D&D and show ‘inaccuracies’, only speaking instead about GRRM and the books. Not a lot of this usually, mind you, but this thread sure is disappointing.

Jojen and Mance is my bet aswell. Funny tough, too see so many people thinking that this means Stannis will live.

Martin always overestimates the importance of some characters, like when he was talking about that Dothraki that Drogo killed in S2.

Anyways this is quite irrellevent too me, as I won’t read TWOW, until after the show is done.

Got fooled once with AFFC, got fooled twice with ADWD. I will not be fooled a third a time.

GRRM- My books are still relevant! Don’t leave me

I don’t really agree with this sentiment, that Martin wants to hurt the show or tries to stay relevant, for only one reason.

He never wanted to release the Sansa chapter from TWOW, it was his publishers who insisted.

I think the same thing happens here, they are afraid they may loose sales if the show spoils most of the major twists, so they make him say things like this, too try and boost the sales by convincing people that the books are different enough that it’s still worth buying them.

I’m gonna guess Jeyne Westerling or Mance. Those who are guessing it’s about Stannis… ever hopeful, huh? Anyway, considering the show is overtaking the books, this is a pretty good way for GRRM to market the relevance of TWOW. A bit obvious, but still.

I myself think it’s Jojen. Because he said two characters, from witch only one is dead in the show.

STANNIS THE MANNIS who doesn’t burn his daughter for no good reason

You’re right, one should only burn a burn a daughter for a good reason! – I’m really Stannis, at least ask the Lord of Light for a coupon from Walmart or something…

I’m not going to bash GRRM, but I really REALLY wish an author wouldn’t let a television show influence his vision…especially D&D’s television show.

It would be far more weird if GRRM hadn’t thought of new plot points and changed stuff around during the time it takes to write a book, it’s a normal part of the process. The show will just have to deal with it shuffling the characters used while getting the point across, if the twist is relevant to the main plot at all.

Abyss: You’re right, one should only burn a burn a daughter for a good reason!

My guess for the dead character is Mance or Barristan. He had first spoken about this a year ago where he had said that the twist would be on a long time character and that it would involve 3 to 4 characters. Besides, when he spoke of this last year, before S5 had aired, he was a bit vague as to why the show could not incorporate this twist, whereas now he has confirmed that the character is dead on the show. So it’s likely that this character died in S5 maybe?

It does feel a bit petty by GRRM, but I can symphatise with him. His stubborn denial that the show would overtake him, has been shattered and it must have been a rude awakening indeed. Like the show has its own twists, so will the books, partly due to them being different medias. Claiming that one is superior to the other will eventually lead to an unreadable clusterfuck of a fansite and I hope this is not going to happen here when the new season starts. I do not want to read in every thread how events happening on the show won’t happen in the books and why a certain moment does or does not spoil GRRM’s plan for the final two or three books. Of course the show will spoil certain events for bookreaders and of course some things happening in the show will not occur in the books and vice versa. We should count ourselves lucky to experience two high quality versions of a compelling story within the boundaries of the medias they are told in, not bicker over which version is better.

Oh, both of them will always be important for the hardcore fans. But it was the masses of casual viewers that got them invited to awards and interviewed on big TV shows, meeting presidents and the queen and all that. And that doesn’t happen anymore after the books are over. Harry Potter was big, but it will be forgotten quickly, as it should be. She writes like the last century of English literature didn’t happen.

My guess is Myrcella, Shireen or Barristan. These three are imo characters important enough to be able to be a part of a significant twist. Jojen too, but it seems like he will be death soon in the books as well. Mance was kind of underused in the show but my sixth sense tells me it’s not him. When it comes to Stannis, until I see his head on spike or something like that, I consider him alive. The same goes for Jon. Jeyne Westerling will surely be a twist all by herself without this new twisty thing, so I don’t think it’s her. It could be also Hizdarh or what’s his name but I think that his story is more or less over either way.

Maybe it is not related to this twist but I remember GRRM saying something like that he visited a european city and a local legend inspired him to write something similar down for one of the characters. Maybe he said it was for a woman? I think if this is the case, it’s understandable that he didn’t think of it in advance.

Yes, he is trying to stay relevant, because in a few weeks in every media we will see articles about the plot points from S6, something that GRRM can’t speak about because he will spoil his own books.

So all attention will be on the HBO, D&D and the actors. They are the ones giving the answers.

And George Lucas created Star Wars, that doesn’t mean that he didn’t destroy it with the prequels.

No one will read unfinished book series in 50 years.

Anyone care to write a comprehensive list of all dead characters in the series that are alive on the books?

Mago, Irri, Rakharo, Xaro Xhoan Daxos, Pyat Pree, Pyp, Grenn, Dagmer, Jojen Reed, Ser Barristan, Selyse, Shireen, Myrcella, Mance Rayder, Hizdarh zo Loraq, LSH, Meryn Trant, Jeyne Westerling and Stannis.

Didn’t he annouce this “twist” on his blog long ago? I remember something like that, or is it a second character he’s talking about now?

Pfff, implying there could be a good reason to burn the one true daughter of Westeros

Found it, it was an interview. He didn explicitly said that the character was dead in the show, only that it couldn’t be done in the show because some decisions D&D took would preclude it. Might be Stannis (if is it indeed the same “twist”)? He wasn’t dead yet last April.

I’m not going to bash GRRM, but I really REALLY wish an author wouldn’t let a television show influence his vision…especially D&D’s television show.

why not? He already said how he liked the show rendering of some minor charachters better than his own, so if something good comes out of the show and fits well in the books, why not?

Tywin of the Hill: Mago, Irri, Rakharo, Xaro Xhoan Daxos, Pyat Pree, Pyp, Grenn, Dagmer, Jojen Reed, Ser Barristan, Selyse, Shireen, Myrcella, Mance Rayder, Hizdarh zo Loraq, LSH, Meryn Trant, Jeyne Westerling and Stannis.

They could pull Xaro out of his vault, stating somebody freed him. Pyat Pree could have been just a vision. There is still room for the show to bring some characters back without to much twist in the story.

This is really sad. The poor man doesn’t see he’s self-sabotaging at this point. I mean, you can’t produce good writing by navigating the story with a spiteful fixation on plot twists to discredit the show.

He doesn’t understand that he can’t screw the show over anymore anyway. It will find ways of circumventing the differences like it’s done countless times before and won’t necessarily be any worse for it. Whatever faults the show does have, they are rarely down to the changes from the books.

All he’ll do is compromise his own vision and work over an unhealthy obsession with someone else’s.

Be careful,some ass licking sychophant is going to quote Neil Gaiman again with that whole Martin is not your bitch crap because how dare someone question the all mighty creator ? These guys are starting to sound like those old Catholic clerics from the 16-17th century .

The books and the show parted ways long ago. Now that the show overtook the books, there will be partisans that would say GRRM is changing the plot just to stay original, whenever something new in the books will be different from the show.

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