cassie-1-2-3 I don't agree with most of these, but I especially disagree with the second one... It's just awful. I'm hoping it was just worded poorly. Is it really saying that rape culture is men not being seen as "asking for it", when dressed scantly? Would it be less rapey if they were assumed to be "asking for it" and raped more often?

tamore ^ lol you're going to wrong way with it. it's not saying men should be assumed to be "asking for it" it's saying women [i]shouldn't[/i] be assumed to be "asking for it." like men they should be able to dress however they want and be respected for it. xo

cassie-1-2-3 Well, if that's what they're saying, then that's probably what they should have said. Saying "Women are assumed to be 'asking for it' when they dress *however* and that's wrong!" is a lot more understandable than "Men aren't assumed to be 'asking for it' when they dress *however* and that's wrong!" It's just another one of those anti-male (aka anti-human) undertones that puts me off from feminism.

tamore I mean, that wording just brings in the fact that rape culture and patriarchy are tied. Pointing out inequality isn't "anti-male."

cassie-1-2-3 That's not what I said. I never said pointing out an inequality is bad. I said saying that men not being the target of rape because they're drunk or because of their clothes, or whatever they're trying to say) is bad because they're not targeted as much as women is anti-make. It's like that person is advocating for more males to be targeted for rape (male or female, it's the same thing) to make it more equal. As if we need to increase the number of rapes rather than decrease.

cassie-1-2-3 Bottom line, I see it as a good thing that "men are allowed to travel, go out at night, get drunk, wear whatever they want--without it being seen as 'asking for it.' ". I can't see how that could possibly think that's a bad thing, unless you are anti-male and are in favor of men being raped.

Cinders Cassie, you can argue over semantics all you want, but the point still stands that how women dress and act are viewed as inviting rape, whereas men are free to dress and act how they want without that same stigma. Rape culture isn't about men, or men's behavior, but about society's behavior (women too). It's not just men who made "Blurred Lines" a top of the charts sensation, but women, too. Feminism is not anti-male. It's feminists who fight to shed more light for male victims of sexual abuse and assault, and feminists who argue that men can be victims of spousal abuse same as women can. It's feminists who pushed for LGBT rights for gay men and women, and it's feminists who claim men should be allowed to pursue any career (including stay-at-home dad) without fear of being seen as "feminized," and that we shouldn't see "feminine" as being weaker or worse than being "masculine" regardless of which sex exhibits stereotypically masculine or feminine features. It seems to me your resistance is psychological. You came to this article with preconceptions and a negative mindset, so you read these points as negative. I will concede that certain rhetoric of certain people calling themselves feminists can come off as harsh and even attacking of men, however it's not men that's the problem, but society as a whole (men and women) and our concept of masculine and feminine and putting all things masculine as superior to all things feminine. Your argument doesn't take away the truths of these points. Victims of rape are shamed whereas excuses are made for perpetrators. You can't argue with the statistics. Rape culture is about a societal view that excuses sexual assault - regardless of the victim (male or female) - because we teach our boys to be aggressive and get what they want at all costs and we teach our girls to be coy and submissive and do as boys say. And if a man is victimized at the hands of another man, it's just another act of male aggression and violence. And if it's a man being victimized by a woman, he's shamed even further, because how dare he allow himself be taken advantage of by the "weaker sex". That's a cultural problem, one I've seen here in the US, and to even greater extents in Ethiopia. For some interesting reading about what rape culture looks like to a foreign woman serving in Africa, please read this blogpost written by a friend of mine. It's crushing and eye-opening (I've been told) for those who don't know what it's like. But I lived through it, so to me it seemed obvious. "But," I already hear dissenters saying, "That's in Africa. We don't treat women like that here. Not anymore, anyway." Perhaps not to that extreme, or to that obvious nature, but it's almost worse here because it's more subtle and people still deny it when it happens. Rape culture and the statistics concerning rape prove that. tl;dr: If you have problems with the semantics of how things are worded, reword them so you can better see the point being made, and then address that point, not the semantics used. I believe you can see and agree with the actual point being made.

PlayingWithFire Whoever came up with "forcible rape" is a straight-up douche. Hasn't that person ever read the dictionary?! When ISN'T rape FORCIBLE?! What a fucking idiot.

cassie-1-2-3 Yes, I know. I purchased Blurred Lines and listen to it at least once a week. I've already been informed that this means I love rape. Yes yes, I know what you're saying. Enough people say it, and clever wording makes it look convincing at times. But in practice, it never seems to be actually demonstrated in that way. Until I actually see something (and I don't mean seeing it typed by someone) my opinion stands as is.

zanhar1 [i]CNN bemoans lost football careers of bright young felons with nary a word for what victims suffer.[/i] I saw that one, it makes me legitimately mad.

Cinders Liking the song doesn't mean you "love rape." It's a catchy song, I'll admit that! I was even caught dancing to it one night at a club. I highly doubt people love the song because they listen to the lyrics. I bet most people who have it have never even considered the lyrics, as most people don't when it comes to dance tunes. Still, the fact that the lyrics are out there and its message is promoted by the media in the music video and live performances with graphic imagery that not many people seem to care shows that it's just a part of our culture. That's what rape culture is. The idea that these things are so OK, we don't even think about it when we see it in songs/movies/tv anymore. It just is.